Urgent Product Safety Alert - Geko brand vivariums

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Re: Urgent Product Safety Alert - Geko brand vivariums

Postby suej » Fri Aug 21, 2009 7:47 am

Thanks Steve, mine says 13amp and 30mA, but I expect that is still Ok?
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Re: Urgent Product Safety Alert - Geko brand vivariums

Postby Steve C » Fri Aug 21, 2009 8:08 am

suej wrote:Thanks Steve, mine says 13amp and 30mA, but I expect that is still Ok?


That's very much alright, Sue. 30mA is about standard and 13A says you can safely use 3 kW with it.

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Re: Urgent Product Safety Alert - Geko brand vivariums

Postby Graham Ray » Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:05 pm

Hi Steve, As I live in Spain now I can comment on spanish installations I've seen, and also on what I think is the UK position.
Am I right in saying that electricity supply companies have now installed in every home an RCD on the mains entering the house adjacent to the company fuse? :?: I believe this RCD will trip if there is more than 30 milliamps current flow between either the live or neutral and earth. This can be a problem in some setups because as some species of tortoise need a humid atmosphere the 30 milliamp RCD can be too sensitive for some setups. what is the answer to this? I know in some commercial greenhouses and swimming pools these devices can be changed for either a 45 or 60 milliamps depending on the installation. :!:

If an RCD is fitted to the incoming supply there is no need to connect another portable RCD at the socket where the appliance is plugged in. If anyone has a problem and it is with tripping of RCD's where dampness or humidity are the problem, please seek expert advise before making what could be a fatal decision. :!:

Here in Spain I have seen some horrendous ly potentially fatal installations because an RCD is working correctly, but has been disconnected because it "keeps tripping" :roll:

Please leave any problems to a competent person. As what seems an easy solution can be a potentially fatal outcome. I hope this makes some readers of this forum aware of the dangers of electicity. ;)
Please consider the environment before printing this post!!

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Re: Urgent Product Safety Alert - Geko brand vivariums

Postby weeg » Fri Oct 02, 2009 1:21 pm

I dont have an RCD on my home. wasnt aware they were being fitted , shall look into that i think

Thanks Graham

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Re: Urgent Product Safety Alert - Geko brand vivariums

Postby Steve C » Sat Oct 03, 2009 2:51 pm

Graham Ray wrote:Am I right in saying that electricity supply companies have now installed in every home an RCD on the mains entering the house adjacent to the company fuse?


Graham

You are not correct in that statement.

All new houses have an RCD fitted adjacent to the consumer distribution board, but I don't know in what year that regulation came into force. The majority of houses, mine included, don't have one fitted. These are usually a 100 amp unit, able to handle the total electrical demand of the house. Whilst these units protect all the house from electrical risk, they have a major drawback. If the unit detects an electrical malfunction and trips, ALL the house's electrical supply, sockets, lights, everything, is interupted.

I have my units arranged so that if one trips due to an electrical problem on its circuit, the other should stay set and keep its appliances supplied with power. This way, I never loose all of the heating/lighting to the torts.

If your house is fitted with a central RCD, you can overcome the total loss of power issue by ensuring that any secondary RCDs that you fit have a lower milliamp rating than the main unit has.

I too have come across people who have an electrical item which continually trips the portable RCD and who have then removed the RCD to cure the problem. How foolish can you get, the RCD is doing its job and there is something wrong with the appliance.

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Re: Urgent Product Safety Alert - Geko brand vivariums

Postby Jonesy » Sat Oct 03, 2009 7:42 pm

My youngest is training to be an electrician, so I can't wait for him to qualify then he can sort out my lot.
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Re: Urgent Product Safety Alert - Geko brand vivariums

Postby Matt » Sat Oct 03, 2009 11:47 pm

Graham Ray wrote:
If an RCD is fitted to the incoming supply there is no need to connect another portable RCD at the socket where the appliance is plugged in.

This maybe fine for a small house & garden where a 15 metre extension will get you most places. But I am regularly out with a 30m plugged in to a shed 40m from the house (in very damp Ireland), now as a RCD's reaction speed can be measured in the house from plug to plug, with milliseconds of difference depending on the cable length etc I for one will keep with a portable RCD as close as possible as only a few milliseconds can save a life. :shock: :? ;)
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Re: Urgent Product Safety Alert - Geko brand vivariums

Postby Graham Ray » Mon Oct 05, 2009 8:01 am

Thanks all for your reply. However everyone should remembeer "its volts that jolts, but mils that kills" and that relates to milliamps not miliseconds. Please check that you have an RCD but if you have one centrally there is no need to have a second. My point is the second one is not protecting anything. As they all trip slightly inside or outside the range, which will trip first? :?: On large and complex electical installation there would be major problems of RCD tripping at different times if they were fitted in series. :!:
Just get a qualified electrician to check and install your installation, keep extension leads off the floor and as short as possible, use the correct size fuse in the plug top, and above all buy good quality reliable equipment.
Please consider the environment before printing this post!!

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Re: Urgent Product Safety Alert - Geko brand vivariums

Postby Graham Ray » Mon Oct 05, 2009 8:18 am

Types of RCD
There are three main types of RCD:
Fixed RCDs – are installed in the consumer unit (fusebox) and can provide protection to individual or groups of circuits. A fixed RCD provides the highest level of protection as it constantly protects all sockets on a circuit and any connected appliances.

Socket-outlet RCDs – are built into a special socket-outlet that replaces a standard socket-outlet. This type of RCD provides protection only to the person in contact with the equipment, including the leads, plugged into the special socket-outlet.

Portable RCDs – plug into any standard socket-outlet. An appliance can then be plugged into the RCD. These are useful when neither fixed nor socket-outlet RCDs are available, but again they provide protection only to the person in contact with the equipment, including the leads, plugged into the portable RCD.

just copied this off the internet to help with any queries that people may have. ;)
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Re: Urgent Product Safety Alert - Geko brand vivariums

Postby Matt » Mon Oct 05, 2009 3:24 pm

I wrote:This maybe fine for a small house & garden where a 15 metre extension will get you most places. But I am regularly out with a 30m plugged in to a shed 40m from the house (in very damp Ireland), now as a RCD's reaction speed can be measured in the house from plug to plug, with milliseconds of difference depending on the cable length etc I for one will keep with a portable RCD as close as possible as only a few milliseconds can save a life. :shock: :? ;)

"However everyone should remembeer "its volts that jolts, but mils that kills" and that relates to milliamps not miliseconds."

Hi Graham,
Unlike you I'm not telling anyone to do anything its really up to them, I just saying what I do & it seems I'm not alone in this.
Sorry I mentioned milliseconds twice in my post, but the point I was trying to make was that if an imbalance in the circuit is detected, that imbalance (current in milliamps or amps) maybe going through you or about to. So the quicker the RCD can react the better in my opinion.
What most of us think of as electricity, moves very fast at a good percentage of the speed of light in fact, but this is still measurable. Would it not be better to have a RCD closer using a long cable run, even if this only saves a few milliseconds of time.
If you are using high power electrical equipment the current flow goes up as well as the chance of a electrocution, you may trust a Main RCD to trip & stop you getting anymore than 30 mA, but I just prefer to have one a bit closer as well.

"If an RCD is fitted to the incoming supply there is no need to connect another portable RCD at the socket where the appliance is plugged in."

I can see no reason for you to tell people twice there is no need to use a portable RCD, it will do no harm & may or may not trip before the main RCD fitted on the Consumer Unit, (depending on its settings and reaction time) but will not interfere with it. Better safe than sorry.

Now I did have a look on the internet to see if I could find anything to back up the using of a Portable RCD as well as a main RCD, when using an extension & power tools & it seems the Northern Territory Government of Australia agree with me which is better than nothing. http://www.worksafe.nt.gov.au/docs/2009 ... rt_rcd.pdf .
Now I find the Aussies quite sensible normally, like banning the import of Red Eared Sliders in to their country.


"keep extension leads off the floor and as short as possible, use the correct size fuse in the plug top, and above all buy good quality reliable equipment."

Well if you buy a good quality extension the length does not matter, it's when people start to use two extensions problems can occur, also not unwinding them fully. If I was going to give any people any advice, which I'm not, I would say don't buy an extension less than 13 amps & make sure the flex is flexible as cheap ones can be stiff & split also making it difficult to wind.
Graham Ray wrote:I believe this RCD will trip if there is more than 30 milliamps current flow between either the live or neutral and earth. This can be a problem in some setups because as some species of tortoise need a humid atmosphere the 30 milliamp RCD can be too sensitive for some setups. what is the answer to this? I know in some commercial greenhouses and swimming pools these devices can be changed for either a 45 or 60 milliamps depending on the installation. :!:

In my limited experience of Forums I find you have to be careful what you say, like you suggesting that changing up to a 45 or 60 milliamp RCD might be the way to go if a 30ma is to "sensitive" :?: I would say the equipment they are using is not suitable for the environment it is in or is wet or corroded, not good thing to have around tortoises or humans. They can do as they like but suggesting this as a possible fix on here and then stating at the end of your post Please leave any problems to a competent person. As what seems an easy solution can be a potentially fatal outcome.
I can agree with you, Wiki saysA low-voltage (110 or 230 V), 50 or 60-Hz AC current through the chest for a fraction of a second may induce ventricular fibrillation at currents as low as 60 mA.
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