250 tortoises seized in Ukraine

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250 tortoises seized in Ukraine

Postby Pam » Mon Jun 22, 2009 10:23 pm

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Re: 250 tortoises seized in Ukraine

Postby Tortoise Trust » Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:54 pm

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Re: 250 tortoises seized in Ukraine

Postby jeff » Tue Jun 23, 2009 1:03 pm

That is so sad to see them wraped in tape,And stolen from there homeland.Jail sentance of up to 5 years does not seem long enougth when you consider those tortoise lives have been wrecked for ever.
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Re: 250 tortoises seized in Ukraine

Postby Tamie Milne » Tue Jun 23, 2009 1:08 pm

How are the smuggled tortoises dealt with in Poland - are they rehomed/returned or destroyed?
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Re: 250 tortoises seized in Ukraine

Postby jeff » Tue Jun 23, 2009 1:18 pm

They go to a zoos so one of the links said :)
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Re: 250 tortoises seized in Ukraine

Postby suej » Tue Jun 23, 2009 1:32 pm

Forgive me for being slightly cynical, but I can’t imagine any zoo being too pleased at receiving 250 tortoises and being expected to house them, feed them .. etc.
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Re: 250 tortoises seized in Ukraine

Postby lynn c » Tue Jun 23, 2009 5:36 pm

That picture is truly horrible. The poor little things were so tightly bound they couldn't move. I hate to think of the pain and suffering they went through when being transported and having to have that tape removed. I do hope that the zoos mentioned care for them, or a least see them rehomed.
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Re: 250 tortoises seized in Ukraine

Postby Pam » Tue Jun 23, 2009 10:48 pm

So 250 tortoises seized on Monday June 22nd in Ukraine, 121 tortoises seized on June 2nd by Polish customs again on the Ukrainian border....dare I ask whether anyone has any data on the scale of the tortoise trade, even just the "legal" bit? Is there UK data available somewhere on tortoise imports here?

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Re: 250 tortoises seized in Ukraine

Postby Tortoise Trust » Wed Jun 24, 2009 7:35 am

Pam wrote:.dare I ask whether anyone has any data on the scale of the tortoise trade, even just the "legal" bit? Is there UK data available somewhere on tortoise imports here?

Pam.


It is always a couple of years out of date, but you can see this here:

http://www.cites.org/eng/resources/trade.shtml

(register first). The figures are pretty staggering, especially for WC Russian tortoises.

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Re: 250 tortoises seized in Ukraine

Postby Pam » Wed Jun 24, 2009 2:04 pm

Thanks for that link Andy.
The numbers are absolutely shocking. I thought that a few hundred was a lot, then saw movements of wild caught in the 1000's, when I saw numbers of 11,000, 16,000 and up to 20,000 there is nothing to say other than :evil:
Some info. for anyone else following this thread:
The main source of graeca is Jordan. 19776 exported in 2007 mainly to Japan and United States. I wonder what type of graeca they are and what happens to them in Japan?
As you say Andy, the Horsfield numbers are the worst. In 2007 24,505 were exported from Ukraine and 36,672 from Uzbekistan. The original source of many of these seems to be Tajikistan.The main importer is the United States (23,209) but GB was the 4th largest importer at a staggering 6,232 - looks like we should have a lot more members!
The 2008 numbers don't look complete yet but one trade deal noted was for 11,000 Horsfields, wild caught in Tajikistan, sent to Ukraine, then imported in Germany.....I doubt that this was the end of their journey.

I know that I have only scratched the surface of this and it only leads on to more questions. The survival percentage in the 60s/70s was abysmal, is it just as bad now? What's the status of the wild populations? What's the difference between captive bred (classification C), captive bred but not in accordance with resolution conf. 10.16 (classification F) and a ranching operation (classification R)? How are any of these captive breeding operations licensed/checked... do they exist in the first place?
And most of all why can't people leave the wild populations alone and set up proper captive breeding centres as per Andy's suggestion?

Time for a cuppa to try and cheer myself up...grump..grump

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