An issue that makes me think

Reports and discussions on all aspects of tortoise and turtle conservation.

Re: An issue that makes me think

Postby Eversfield » Sat Oct 31, 2009 3:03 pm

suggest you look at the Centro Carapax website. They claim numbers of Chelonia-( Mostly Trachemys I believe)
The numbers vary from one post to another, however, back in March April this was as high as 18,000, but on the same site the numbers went down to 14000, then 13,000. Hard to know the exact truth?
Whatever number you choose though it is a massive overpopulation on quite a small area of contested land.
The website has recently, before the result of the latest Court verdict, posted a video on you tube. It is worth seeing, as it shows very overcrowded Louisiana pond, with admittedly a little more water evident since my last visit. One has to understand though that Evaporation during a Tuscan Summer will reduce water levels dramatically. If it looks crowded with this volume of water imagine what it is like after the Summer sun does its worst! :(
Paul Eversfield
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Re: An issue that makes me think

Postby Tortoise Trust » Sun Nov 01, 2009 8:10 am

One of the big problems when people behave recklessly or in any other way that is, by normal standards, indefensible, is that it plays straight into the hands of those who wish to ban reptile keeping completely. Some of these people (I will mention no names!) think they are "defending the rights" of reptile keepers - but they are not. They are simply providing more ammunition to those trying to ban the entire principle of private individuals (or even zoos) of keeping ANY reptile in captivity, for any reason (as is the case in Norway). For example, see:

I know the people involved with this and recently joined it. Not because I agree with everything they say, but because I think some of what they say is bad science, a gross exaggeration and over-reaction and because I profoundly disagree with where they are coming from (and going to) with this. The only way to be heard is to take part in the debate.

When I refer to bad science and over-reaction I'd especially point out the constant references to salmonella infections. Take a close look at the language used and the prominence this receives on the above website. The true facts are very different: ... utH6o4WOSw

The truth is that cases of reptile-related salmonella infections are rare - and it is reasonable to assume that of those, most, if not all would have been easily preventable by the keepers following the most simple hygiene precautions. Compare to cases resulting from the food industry... I note that they are not trying to ban all farm animals, however! On the contrary, in a very strange move indeed, these Animal Rights supporters actually seem to suggest that it would HELP the intensive agriculture industry if pet reptile keeping was banned!

"Livestock industries are also at risk from disease issues associated with wildlife trade – it has been estimated that damage to these industries has cost hundreds of billions of dollars globally."

I find it bizarre that anyone associated with the principles of Animal Rights would care much about "damage" to the "livestock industries"!!!

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Re: An issue that makes me think

Postby Jordi » Sun Nov 01, 2009 10:32 pm

With the alarm about the Salmonela infection risc also the media had their part of reponsability.
Just as an example: in my country, not a long time ago, the media focussed in the danger of certain dog breeds (Rottweilers). Every day there were news about Rottweiler´s or Stafforshire terrier & family agressions. Any black dog´s attack was done by a Rottweiler. Any Boxer was a pitbull. It seemed that, when you crossed the street, a dog would jump straight to your throat.
The problem was not so simple as to ban certain breeds. The first thing was to evaluate if those breeds were really responsible for most dog´s attacks, in wich situation the atacks took place, etc.etc. but the social alarm that the media created played a very important role in the redaction of a law.
Curiously, in the last two years, not a single case of dog attack . But I would like to see the hospital´s statistics (and what breeds if any)
I wish the media don´t focuss in reptile keeping if there is ever a problem that creates social alarm.

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