What MBD looks like - from the inside

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What MBD looks like - from the inside

Postby Tortoise Trust » Sun Nov 17, 2013 8:11 am

I am posting these because they illustrate so very well why getting diet (and UVB) right is so absolutely critical. What you are seeing here are tortoise carapaces from the inside. These are tortoises that died as a result of illness, or predator attack, incidentally - none were harmed just to obtain this data.

In these two examples, one is a wild T. graeca. The other was a pet, raised from a hatchling in captivity.

Compare. Look specifically at the bone structure.

Wild tortoise, carapace
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Captive raised, carapace
Image

Wild tortoise, plastron
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Captive raised, plastron
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Wild tortoise, bridge section
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Captive raided, bridge section
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The weights (per sq. cm) of the bone are also very different. The density is not the same. This is what is really happening when we talk about 'MBD' or metabolic bone disease. It is not always very obvious externally, but if you are getting very high growth rates, this is very likely what is happening inside.
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Re: What MBD looks like - from the inside

Postby carmalee » Sun Nov 17, 2013 4:11 pm

Non experienced keepers (like me) would have no idea whatsoever that this was taking place in their pets through incorrect feeding and husbandry. I found this fascinating and once again, thank you Tortoise Trust for the expert information.
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Re: What MBD looks like - from the inside

Postby Bigjoe » Mon Nov 18, 2013 12:24 am

Looks brittle and weak with the captive raised example
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Re: What MBD looks like - from the inside

Postby Avatar » Mon Nov 18, 2013 8:34 am

For the photo "Captive raised, plastron", it looks like there is some bruise?? near the neck area. Is this a sign of severe MBD? internal bleeding of shell?

I once had a tortoise and she also had these "bruise".....the vet said she had late stage of MBD....The bruise started to appear around 1-2 weeks before she died and she got more bruise near her death.... She had UVB bulb 10.0 and sometime could have natural light....still not sure what had happened... :|

Looking these photos really reminds me of her... :cry:
Regards,
Gloria

1 Sulcata
1 Testudo Graeca
1 Red Ear Slider
1 Chinese Striped-necked turtle
1 Reeves's turtle
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Re: What MBD looks like - from the inside

Postby Daryn » Mon Nov 18, 2013 6:43 pm

Excellent post very interesting.
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Re: What MBD looks like - from the inside

Postby Tracy33 » Tue Nov 19, 2013 12:18 am

Very interesting indeed , it is an eye opener .
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Re: What MBD looks like - from the inside

Postby Tortoise Trust » Tue Nov 19, 2013 5:53 am

Yes, and believe me, this is nowhere near as bad as what you find on seriously deformed 'pyramided' examples. They can be far worse.

The 'bruising' mentioned is indeed often associated with MBD and is due to internal bleeding. It is worth noting that not every case of MBD or bone density loss is necessarily diet related; hormonal imbalances or kidney disease can also be responsible, especially in juveniles. The vast majority of cases, however, are caused by incorrect husbandry and are preventable.
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Re: What MBD looks like - from the inside

Postby Tortoise Trust » Tue Nov 19, 2013 6:34 am

We have been doing a lot of work on this... we obtain "wild" material whenever we find it. We have been collecting samples for 4 years now, so have a very representative and statistically large sample base.

Image

This allows us to do accurate comparisons to captive reared examples (which we obtain from rescue centres, vets, etc.)

Image

This one is obviously deformed... but absolutely nowhere near as bad as some that you encounter...look at some of the examples on "Preloved". Can you imagine what they are like internally?

Remember this one?

Image
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Re: What MBD looks like - from the inside

Postby Tortoise Trust » Tue Nov 19, 2013 10:17 am

Here's an example of subcutaneous hemorrhaging resulting from severe MBD.

Image
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Re: What MBD looks like - from the inside

Postby Daryn » Tue Nov 19, 2013 1:16 pm

Its aweful, the first torte I rehomed has it bad, ohhhhhhhhh why dont people read before purchasing
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